GAS Dear Giary!

Jan Steinman

Regular
Location
Bellingham, Washington, USA
Name
Jan Steinman
you end up having a system from each. :hmmm:
Not me!

You talking to a mouse in your pocket? :)

I started out at about five, on a Kodak Brownie. Rather than sending it in after each exposure, my Dad pried open the case, developed the film in our darkroom, then cut film (from 4"x5" sheets) and re-loaded it!

So with that background, I don't feel any need to try any and all brands, just because they might do one small feature better than the brand I've been specializing in.

When I see something special done on some other camera, I set out to see if I can do it with my camera! Technique trumps technology!
 

Jan Steinman

Regular
Location
Bellingham, Washington, USA
Name
Jan Steinman
But when I do come home with something…
You bought another DAMN CAMERA, didn't you?.jpg
 
Location
Finland
With a plenty of sugar and caffeine in my system, I dared to take a look at my Metabones speedboosting F/M43 adapter to see if I can do anything to its little problem.

The problem was, the adapter didn't allow a Nikon F mount lens to fully close. For example my 50mm Nikkor-SC f/1.4 only had apertures f/1.4 to f/5.6 available.

I knew it must be a physical thingie somewhere. The metal flap thing in the adapter seemed suspect, somehow bent. I think it was just fine, the real problem being in the arc whatsamacallit. For now, I bent the flap in the opposite direction knowing it wasn't the right mechanical solution but it did the job. For this one lens at least. I'll know I fouled up if a slower max aperture lens won't mount on the adapter. But I'll leave that for another day. I will be careful with the flap. If I lose it, cripple the adapter, I'll lose G lens support. But as I don't have any G lenses and maybe never will, it's not a pressing issue on my mind right of now.

Next thing on my little caffeine rush agenda, see if I can do a workaround to a weird bug/behavior on the EM1.2 in MF mode, with certain settings. There's something going on there and it lessens my pleasure using the camera.
 
Location
Finland
The last few days, a little over a week or so, I've been suffering from some mild Fuji GAS.

In my mind I've been fitting Fuji between these two mirrorless adapter powerhouse cameras.

(1) I've been getting just sensational results from adapting Nikkors to Olympus via the speedbooster. The system has a manageable crop factor of 1.4 and I capture a lot of good stuff. Thanks to the IBIS and general fluency of E-M1.2, I feel like I can extract more out of the Nikkors than on a real Nikon DSLR! The Metabones speedbooster may be the best-in-class but still degrades the picture outside the center. This is on par of the design compromises of a focal reducer of course, and hasn't bothered me much.

(2) Panasonic S1 needs no focal reducers. It can really extract the goods out of a lens I adapt on it. The magnificent EVF, and robust weathersealed body with a useful top LCD, and IBIS that's only a little behind the Olympus in its prowess. Just a shame about the grip that's a tad too large for my hand.

(3) And Fujifilm... is the Goldilocks between these two?


Perhaps not. In my fantasies I try my best to fit it between (1) and (2) but the reality doesn't necessarily agree with me.

  • The situation in 5 years will be different, but today most of the (used) Fuji bodies are unstabilized, giving much IQ edge to both (1) and (2) for night time shooting.
  • The closest Goldilocks Fuji between the two is definitely X-T5 but it's expensive right now. I have little doubt it can stabilize to the same as Panasonic S1 so it's definitely enough.
  • Fuji bodies fit in my hand, definite win over Panasonic S1.
  • There's many Fuji bodies available in stylish Chrome and Graphite colors. Big win over Oly/Pana.
  • The viewfinder of XT3-5 is probably much sharper than that of E-M1.2. Goldilocks!
    • But will the feed remain fluent as it does on S1 and Olympus even in the darkest of conditions? Important!
  • Xpro2 with its window finder is a real distinction over other mirrorless cameras on the market right now.
    • The OVF will naturally remain the fluidest of them all, under any light.
    • The OVF: the true choice of an explorer. I hopefully covered some of this topic earlier...
  • DR matters aside, focusing on the subjective aesthetics of high-ISO grain: I think older Fuji sensors (Xtrans II/III) fall way behind Olympus and Panasonic. Panasonics, both M4/3 and full frame, are simply winners in my view when it comes to the matters of grain. Just beautiful stuff. Olympus is also very neat, pretty grain. The Xtrans demosaic algorithms can still produce some alarming patterns on some sample raw files I've studied.
  • Larger sensor means better options on adapting/speedboosting lenses. Larger sensor means more forgiveness for old lenses. This is one Goldilocks aspect.
  • Easier to adapt Pentax K DA lenses on Fuji.
A hypothetical jump from Olympus/Panasonic to Fuji is a lose-lose proposition in many ways. But keeping with the "OVF 2023" theme, I maintain that the OVF of Xpro2 is such a grand idea for a mirrorless camera. I think this is where my GAS stems from.

As usual with GAS explosions, there's also a spark behind all this.

~

I am eagerly anticipating what OM Systems will bring out next. There's a lot of cynical takes on what's going to happen. That's why it will be even more interesting to see.

Secondly, given what Fuji did with the X-T5, people are probably getting excited about directions Xpro4 is going about.
 

Jan Steinman

Regular
Location
Bellingham, Washington, USA
Name
Jan Steinman
The Metabones speedbooster may be the best-in-class but still degrades the picture outside the center. This is on par of the design compromises of a focal reducer of course…
Perhaps I just drunk the Caldwell Kool Aid, but I seriously find that I get better results with a vintage lens on a quality focal reducer than I do without.

When I crop the focal-reduced image to match the one made with a straight adapter, the focal-reduced image appears better in all areas.

So much so, that I have focal reducers more-or-less permanently attached to my all favourite vintage lenses. It takes a really, really good vintage lens to show the difference between a Metabones Speedbooster Ultra and a Viltrox EF-M2 II, so I use a lot of the latter (with a thin EF-OM ring), saving the MSU for my best vintage glass. I also find the Zhongyi to be pretty much equal to the Viltrox, but still a step behind the Metabones, especially in corners and edges.
 
Location
Talent, Oregon (far from the madding crowd)
Name
Miguel Tejada-Flores
The last few days, a little over a week or so, I've been suffering from some mild Fuji GAS.

In my mind I've been fitting Fuji between these two mirrorless adapter powerhouse cameras.

(1) I've been getting just sensational results from adapting Nikkors to Olympus via the speedbooster. The system has a manageable crop factor of 1.4 and I capture a lot of good stuff. Thanks to the IBIS and general fluency of E-M1.2, I feel like I can extract more out of the Nikkors than on a real Nikon DSLR! The Metabones speedbooster may be the best-in-class but still degrades the picture outside the center. This is on par of the design compromises of a focal reducer of course, and hasn't bothered me much.

(2) Panasonic S1 needs no focal reducers. It can really extract the goods out of a lens I adapt on it. The magnificent EVF, and robust weathersealed body with a useful top LCD, and IBIS that's only a little behind the Olympus in its prowess. Just a shame about the grip that's a tad too large for my hand.

(3) And Fujifilm... is the Goldilocks between these two?


Perhaps not. In my fantasies I try my best to fit it between (1) and (2) but the reality doesn't necessarily agree with me.

  • The situation in 5 years will be different, but today most of the (used) Fuji bodies are unstabilized, giving much IQ edge to both (1) and (2) for night time shooting.
  • The closest Goldilocks Fuji between the two is definitely X-T5 but it's expensive right now. I have little doubt it can stabilize to the same as Panasonic S1 so it's definitely enough.
  • Fuji bodies fit in my hand, definite win over Panasonic S1.
  • There's many Fuji bodies available in stylish Chrome and Graphite colors. Big win over Oly/Pana.
  • The viewfinder of XT3-5 is probably much sharper than that of E-M1.2. Goldilocks!
    • But will the feed remain fluent as it does on S1 and Olympus even in the darkest of conditions? Important!
  • Xpro2 with its window finder is a real distinction over other mirrorless cameras on the market right now.
    • The OVF will naturally remain the fluidest of them all, under any light.
    • The OVF: the true choice of an explorer. I hopefully covered some of this topic earlier...
  • DR matters aside, focusing on the subjective aesthetics of high-ISO grain: I think older Fuji sensors (Xtrans II/III) fall way behind Olympus and Panasonic. Panasonics, both M4/3 and full frame, are simply winners in my view when it comes to the matters of grain. Just beautiful stuff. Olympus is also very neat, pretty grain. The Xtrans demosaic algorithms can still produce some alarming patterns on some sample raw files I've studied.
  • Larger sensor means better options on adapting/speedboosting lenses. Larger sensor means more forgiveness for old lenses. This is one Goldilocks aspect.
  • Easier to adapt Pentax K DA lenses on Fuji.
A hypothetical jump from Olympus/Panasonic to Fuji is a lose-lose proposition in many ways. But keeping with the "OVF 2023" theme, I maintain that the OVF of Xpro2 is such a grand idea for a mirrorless camera. I think this is where my GAS stems from.

As usual with GAS explosions, there's also a spark behind all this.

~

I am eagerly anticipating what OM Systems will bring out next. There's a lot of cynical takes on what's going to happen. That's why it will be even more interesting to see.

Secondly, given what Fuji did with the X-T5, people are probably getting excited about directions Xpro4 is going about.

Being an eccentric iconoclast who generally marches to the multiple beats of my own strange drums - and also being a person with tendency to like (and use extensively) older borderline obsolete cameras - I will only add one comment to your reflections about Fuji's cameras-- you didn't mention what for me is and, I think, has been, the primary attraction of the two Fujifilm cameras I've used extensively (the X-Pro3 and now the X-T3) over the last few years--- namely, the capacities of their (different) X-Trans sensors at creating and rendering a wide variety of jpeg "recipes" for in-camera film simulations. I've gotten addicted to them and have discovered a number of favorites (quite a few of which were created by Ritchie Roesch on his FujiXWeekly website, but also a handful of others pioneered by a handful of interesting Fujiaddicts worldwide). The newer X-Trans sensors have more (and more expanded) capabilities in this department, but even the "older" ones (like my current X-T3) offer a variety of riches, so to speak.

So much so that basically I've only shot jpegs with my Fujis over the past few years, with (as yet) zero regrets.
I've only shot mainly jpegs with two other digital cameras, really. One was my Pen-F, whose internal color software I found equally addictive; the other is my smallish Lumix, the GX9, whose internal black & white film-inspired jpeg setting, l.monochrome.d, is one of my favorites ever (and turns the camera into my inexpensive version of a 'Monochrom').

On my two Olympiiii (the newer E-M5.3 with its ingeniously updated algorithms that, among other things, almost turn the camera into a compact alternative to the E-M1X) and its older small sibling, an E-P3 (for me one of the nicest digital Pens ever, in spite of its lack of an internal EVF) I almost always shoot RAW (for all the usual reasons) - but, so far, with my Fujis, I never have.

And, yes, the old adage still seems to ring true...for me, the best camera is...the one I have with me, that particular day.

But I sympathize with your GAS ruminations, Mike - and in particular, your interest in the new X-T5. Though, for me, my fascination with it is centered largely on the ingenious new jpeg film simulation the Fuji imaging geniuses created for it (and for their newer GFX cameras as well), "Nostalgic Negative". Let's just say its colour possibilities are on the tempting side ;)
 
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Location
Finland
@MiguelATF, you really rock those in-camera JPEG engines on whatever cameras you happen to be shooting. :)

I probably couldn't get back to being a jpeg shooter in a good while yet.

I gave up jpegs practically for good in 2017 when I jumped from the X100T to Leica Q. The former, being a Fuji, had so nice jpegs I couldn't replicate them in raw in a million years. Then at the same time, Leica Q was critized a lot for its lacking JPEG engine. I took it as my cue to make the jump into that whole world of raws. I had to learn new tricks and suddenly my edit & postprocess started to took hours instead of minute. But I also learned a lot about the data a camera captures, ETTR and all that.

One of my fears about going back to JPEGs involve my early days with the X100T, shooting a lot of stuff in a bold color; Fuji Velvia. I look back at that stuff, unrecoverable. Too candylike to my modern taste. Maybe today's me has some necessary experience to be able to successfully commit to a film style that suits the scene and mood, but let's say "saturated Velvia for everything" may not be it. :)

Fuji jpegs are a thing of beauty but I picked up bad habits early on, needing to crop often after a careless shoot. JPEGs can be cropped losslessly but it was a weird hassle, back then I didn't have much of a process over my edit&pp. And let's not even start about how much horizon straightening my pictures need!

And something that bothered me, already during my jpeg days, was the noise reduction that one couldn't fully disable. It just took the detail, and soul, of high-ISO photographs.

Then I also started to appreciate local edits a lot, something that an in-camera JPEG engine (save for Zeiss ZX1 or phones) usually doesn't bother with.

Not to mention that I wolfed down all the fuji reviews and Fujifilm "feelgood" articles and everything during those early years (around 2015-2017), and I just noticed that the prettiest reds and nicest tones, contrastiest clouds, they all were processed from raw, per the authors of all those articles. They'd all praise the Fuji jpegs but would use Lightroom at the end of the day. I wanted those reds, tones, contrasty clouds. I read a lot of good things about how the newer Fujis offer so much more control at jpegs than those Xtrans2-era Fujis that were around back then.

All in all, having all this control in my hands is something that's been very much "me" ever since that summer of 2017.
 
Location
Finland
Perhaps I just drunk the Caldwell Kool Aid, but I seriously find that I get better results with a vintage lens on a quality focal reducer than I do without.
You know, I have made the same observation myself. :)

And plenty other people also, not always in relation to a focal reducing adapter, but for example a filter or a add-on lens that widens the view, reviewers often remark about the increased sharpness.

I trust the white paper on this one, but it happens at the expense of the edges.
 
(2) Panasonic S1 needs no focal reducers. It can really extract the goods out of a lens I adapt on it. The magnificent EVF, and robust weathersealed body with a useful top LCD, and IBIS that's only a little behind the Olympus in its prowess. Just a shame about the grip that's a tad too large for my hand.

(3) And Fujifilm... is the Goldilocks between these two?


Perhaps not. In my fantasies I try my best to fit it between (1) and (2) but the reality doesn't necessarily agree with me.
I assume you're aware of the S5 II? Should be a little smaller than se S1, I've gathered. No OVF, though, thus no cake...

It also seems like your Fuji itch isn't going to go away without scratching. Just keep in mind the X-Pro OVF is of limited use. I'm not sure about the later versions, but on the X-Pro1 it was only useful for a couple of focal lengths, having only two magnifications.

But since you already have the Leica, what good would you get from the X-Pro?
 
Location
Finland
I assume you're aware of the S5 II? Should be a little smaller than se S1, I've gathered. No OVF, though, thus no cake...
The Panasonic S5ii is a great idea, to replace S1. I initially dismissed it on three points: (a) the EVF is not as gloriously specced as the S1, and (b) fully articulating screen, and (c) high price, since it's fresh new.

But I then noticed a deal for a brand-new S5 kit. Get the S5 and 20-60 for 1800 €, get a 50mm f/1.8 thrown in for free. The body will cost about 1100 € after lenses. Can't get the same kit from MPB for example.

It's getting my juices flow a little bit.

For point (a), but of course S5 has even lower-specced EVF. Oh no! But I started to reason: I'm happy focusing manually with Olympus E-M1.2 and it has the same specs but I think Panasonic is feeding the EVF better signal, making it better. So maybe (a) won't be that bad.

For point (b), I can tolerate the FAS. With manual focus lenses in the dark one "cannot" use the screen anyway to much good. Back-screen-composing is an affair with autofocusing native lenses to me.

I haven't held an S5 in my hand but I can trust it to be a good one, ergonomically. G9 and S1 have the goods. Panasonic DNA is fantastic. I would miss the top LCD, though.

But perhaps overall, going this direction is not the best idea. I want to be losing, not gaining. And it's 1800 € which suddenly feels like a lot of money.

It also seems like your Fuji itch isn't going to go away without scratching. Just keep in mind the X-Pro OVF is of limited use. I'm not sure about the later versions, but on the X-Pro1 it was only useful for a couple of focal lengths, having only two magnifications.

I was researching this aspect the other day but I think I got lost. :)

But if I understood correctly, the framelines adjust to arbitrary FLs which is better than on M. There are two levels of magnification, which is one level more than on M. Sure enough, both levels are inadequate for tele lenses such as 90mm/135mmeqv? Should see it firsthand.

Review: Fujifilm X-Pro 2 - Page 2 of 4 - Admiring Light this page in this review gives me an encouraging writeup what to expect. I know rangefinders so I don't certainly expect it to be usable with 200 mm lenses. Simple optical realities dictate this.


But since you already have the Leica, what good would you get from the X-Pro?
This is a mighty good question.

I have adapted Nikkors on my Leica M and it can be a pleasant affair where I focus using the EVF and then shift my eye on the optical rangefinder to time my shot.

But the EVF on M is not very good. The optics in it hurt my eye, it's a huge battery drain, the resolution indecent, and night sight nonexistent.

Fuji X-Pro2 gains two alternative EVFs and an easy switch to flip between EVF/OVF. I've used the X100 to good success and appreciate the implementation of the switch. People say the corner EVF causes some inexplicable lag, which is my main concern.

Then the X-Pro2 also gains a couple of stops of ISO performance over M, even if the sensor mosaic and noise pattern can be a hit/miss compared to M. Burst speeds also help.

And a select few native Fuji lenses interests me. It can lead to a bad path, to an unhappy place.
 

Jan Steinman

Regular
Location
Bellingham, Washington, USA
Name
Jan Steinman
… it happens at the expense of the edges.
Don't really want to start an argument that no one can win, but my impression is that the edges and corners are considerably sharper, too.

I think focal reducers provide better telecentricity, too, as a number of my wide vintage lenses that show CA and vignetting in the edges are cleaned up nicely with the Metabones, at least. This seems especially true the wider the angle gets. Wide-angle film designs were retrofocal, and the light in the corners was at a pretty steep angle.
 
But if I understood correctly, the framelines adjust to arbitrary FLs which is better than on M. There are two levels of magnification, which is one level more than on M. Sure enough, both levels are inadequate for tele lenses such as 90mm/135mmeqv? Should see it firsthand.
Framelines adjust, yes. According to focal length and to correct for parallax. Accuracy should be in the ballpark, though leaving some leeway for correcting in post might be a good idea. No idea how all this works with adapted lenses, though. Never tried any of that shizzle.

Regarding the M, I was thinking in terms of native lenses, and completely glossed over the idea of adapting random glassware. My bad. For that, the XPro should be at least much more convenient, since no external EVF is needed.

I guess here FAFO (f@ck around and find out) is a completely viable mode of operation, since no harm will be done aside from your wallet. And since torturing wallets has not yet been banned by the UN, you're good to go, I guess.
 
Location
Finland
Framelines adjust, yes. According to focal length and to correct for parallax. Accuracy should be in the ballpark, though leaving some leeway for correcting in post might be a good idea. No idea how all this works with adapted lenses, though. Never tried any of that shizzle.

Regarding the M, I was thinking in terms of native lenses, and completely glossed over the idea of adapting random glassware. My bad. For that, the XPro should be at least much more convenient, since no external EVF is needed.

I guess here FAFO (f@ck around and find out) is a completely viable mode of operation, since no harm will be done aside from your wallet. And since torturing wallets has not yet been banned by the UN, you're good to go, I guess.
I definitely have a nice stable of native, rangefinder-coupled lenses for M. No problem in that department whatsoever. :cool:

But each lens is unique, and M lenses don't focus very near, so there's definitely demand for adapting and shooting foreign glass.

And now with the whole discussion about speedboosters, I'm afraid my newest followup idea to this is to treat each lens/speedbooster/sensor combination as a unique imaging machine. Can be a very expensive idea to explore. 😅
 
Location
Finland
I assume you're aware of the S5 II? Should be a little smaller than se S1, I've gathered. No OVF, though, thus no cake...
Panasonic is sponsoring this campaign to give an extra 500 € off of a trade when you purchase a brand new S5ii.

In one way this is interesting because I could trade in my S1 and recover a couple hundred € more, and I'd get a camera I just know is a solid workhorse for adapting. Maybe the EVF is not as awe-inspiring but it's a solid one.

But... there's a big but in this. S5ii brand-spanking-new is a lot of dough. Panasonic has a sordid history of devalueing their gear, massive sales shortly after the early adopters have gotten theirs. And I have little use for CAF so the main selling point of S5ii is completely wasted on me. Under slightly different circumstances it could be a beautiful thing. (What circumstances, I don't know. For a big action camera I'd rather go for Nikon D500 any day. Hell, you can buy a D5 + 70-200/2.8 kit used for the money S5ii goes for new.)


I sent an inquiry regardless. The trade-in bonus in a way makes the body at 1789 €. If I like what I am hearing for trade value, who knows...
 
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Location
Finland
I sent an inquiry regardless. The trade-in bonus in a way makes the body at 1789 €. If I like what I am hearing for trade value, who knows...
They mean well but they only offer 700 € for the trade-in. And I'm not sure if they are going to pay that much since it was an initial email inquiry.

With the tradein bonus that's 1200 € off which is not so bad. But here's the big thing.

Panasonic is having another January deal for S5 cameras, and for 1799 € -- 10 € more than the S5ii -- I could buy a kit of S5, 20-60, and 50/1.8. And no trading necessary. The S5ii doesn't have a lot going on for it.

These January campaigns end today so I'm probably good and buy nothing. But it might be a tense 10 hours remaining this month...
 

RichardC

Top Veteran
Location
Royal Town of Sutton Coldfield, UK.
Name
Richard
They mean well but they only offer 700 € for the trade-in. And I'm not sure if they are going to pay that much since it was an initial email inquiry.

With the tradein bonus that's 1200 € off which is not so bad. But here's the big thing.

Panasonic is having another January deal for S5 cameras, and for 1799 € -- 10 € more than the S5ii -- I could buy a kit of S5, 20-60, and 50/1.8. And no trading necessary. The S5ii doesn't have a lot going on for it.

These January campaigns end today so I'm probably good and buy nothing. But it might be a tense 10 hours remaining this month...
EUR 1799 is a good deal - even better if you sell whatever it was you were planning to part exchange.
 
Location
Finland
EUR 1799 is a good deal - even better if you sell whatever it was you were planning to part exchange.
Of course it's only a good deal if one buys it for a real need. 😅😅



I sent this store an inquiry for quote. See what they respond, and if they respond in time. A quote is no good if they return to me tomorrow when the original kit deal is over.
 
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