Nikon Nikon Z fc Talk

Location
S. Oregon Coast
Real Name
Andrew L
I feel like we need a spot to talk about this camera, because it's kind of a surprising move from Nikon. I had only briefly looked at the Z50 previously, and, while I know that Matt likes it (as I recall), it just never moved the needle. This camera does, and it's not just for the good looks. What are your thoughts?
 
Location
S. Oregon Coast
Real Name
Andrew L
To follow up myself, I wish there was IBIS, as I am firmly entrenched in IBIS-having systems, with both M4/3 and Pentax, plus the GRIII. It would be difficult to consider going back to not having it, but if the Z's APS-C sensor has very good high-ISO performance, maybe. I consider both the direct controls and the articulated screen to be design cues I look for now. I considered the Fuji XE4 briefly, but I really do prefer the SLR style over RF style for mirrorless cameras, even though I prefer real rangefinders to SLRs, plus while the tilting screen on the Fuji is decent, being very slim, since I got the Olympus EM5ii I really prefer to keep the LCD folded back on itself, it allows my thumb to comfortably rest on a textured surface where I would have to avoid placing it when glass was in the way.

But what's with this lack of lenses? Nikon sure has been slow getting APS-C Z-mount lenses out.
 

CraigC

Top Veteran
Location
Toronto, Canada
Real Name
Craig
Looks like a great camera, but really should have been FF IMO. That might come, and would make a great offering paired with the new 28mm and upcoming 40mm pancake/muffin lenses.

But, this camera with just that 28mm does look like a good offering. Could perhaps compete against Fuji’s X100 series if one doesn’t want the versatility of an ILC.

They definitely hit the mark on the looks department. Exactly like the FM’s of past.
 
Location
Switzerland
Real Name
Matt

It is a nice looking unit, that's for sure. I'd miss IBIS also, is it common in the Nikon world to not have it?
So far, the APC-C bodies don't have it; I think Nikon tried to keep them as compact as possible. And I think to keep the gestalt they were aiming for as close to the original as possible, they went for the APS-C body first (the "fc" suggests the possibility of an "f", I think). I.B.I.S. as Nikon can provide it and FF would have made the body considerably bigger. I wouldn't have minded, but the goal was to get a digital FE/FM ... and I actually think they pretty much succeeded at that, size-wise. I have an FE here, I'll be able to compare directly ...

re. the Z 50: It's a camera that really grows on you - it's much nicer in use than its somewhat pedestrian specs suggest. The most notable asset is something deceptively ordinary: the grip and overall balance is phenomenal. However, the whole package works much better than I would ever have guessed. I wanted a portable Z camera and got exactly that. But: The Z fc is more elegant and even slimmer, and I love the mix of classic controls (something I love to have when I want and/or need it) and a familiar two-dial interface for more modern handling .. It's right up my alley in almost all respects, but I'm interested in finding out how well it handles with even slightly bigger lenses (without an additional grip).

We'll see. I'll most probably pre-order next week (I'm waiting for our local prices to be confirmed) :)

M.
 

phigmov

Probably Not Walter Kernow
Location
Aotearoa
Enjoyed the DPReview preview with Chris & Jordan. The proportions always seem off in pictures but holding it side by side with a FE made it seem nicely-sized. Like others, the APS-C thing seems odd - I'm guessing they've run the numbers with regard to cost/benefit and maintaining various lens mount systems on the production line. I love the look of it but (a) could never afford it new (b) don't want to invest in a new lens system (I've got plenty of F mount lenses to use on my film & digital Nikons that I can't be bothered adapting)

 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Location
SW Virginia
Real Name
Steve
I said this else where, but I think the Df is the FF version. It just came first. They should update the Df, maybe. I do think the idea of going retro with APSC is a good idea. It directly gives them a way to compete with Fuji for this niche.

I find it funny to think about this camera going up against the A6xxx series.
 
Location
S. Oregon Coast
Real Name
Andrew L
I said this else where, but I think the Df is the FF version. It just came first. They should update the Df, maybe. I do think the idea of going retro with APSC is a good idea. It directly gives them a way to compete with Fuji for this niche.

I find it funny to think about this camera going up against the A6xxx series.
I'd say they only have a real chance of winning in the retro field if they commit to primes. I get that casual users usually go with zooms, but there is a whole fleet of Fuji users for whom the prime lens stable is a main attraction, if nothing else they're all going to continue sending a contrary message to new buyers who might otherwise be swayed by Nikon's marketing.
 

gryphon1911

Hall of Famer
Location
Central Ohio, USA
Real Name
Andrew

It is a nice looking unit, that's for sure. I'd miss IBIS also, is it common in the Nikon world to not have it?

Nikon has only had IBIS in their Z5, Z6 and Z7 cameras. All other stabilization systems are in lens in their DSLR systems.

The Z50 did not have IBIS and this one does not either.

In other notes, it appears that the Zfc will have the upgraded AF system from the Z6II/Z7II which is great to see.
 
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drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Location
SW Virginia
Real Name
Steve
Nikon has only had IBIS in their Z6 and Z7 cameras. All other stabilization systems are in lens in their DSLR systems.

The Z50 did not have IBIS and this one does not either.

In other notes, it appears that the Zfc will have the upgraded AF system from the Z6II/Z7II which is great to see.
One way or the other, I like IBIS but it’s not a dealbreaker for me. Fuji broke me of that requirement.
 
Location
S. Oregon Coast
Real Name
Andrew L
I mentioned that IBIS might be less of a concern if the high-ISO performance is good; DPR's Z50 review had some good performance in their test image. Obviously high-ISO performance doesn't help if I want to use a slow shutter handheld for artistic purposes - I'm used to having it in M4/3 in order to counteract the poor noise performance. I went to Camerasize to compare it with my Olympus EM5ii just for kicks, as expected there's a significant size difference, but look at the weight comparison! Z fc vs. EM5ii Shows just how dense and overbuilt the shell of the EM5ii is (a factor I quite like about that camera).
 

CraigC

Top Veteran
Location
Toronto, Canada
Real Name
Craig
I said this else where, but I think the Df is the FF version. It just came first. They should update the Df, maybe. I do think the idea of going retro with APSC is a good idea. It directly gives them a way to compete with Fuji for this niche.

I find it funny to think about this camera going up against the A6xxx series.

The Df was the previous SLR version, but they need a FF mirrorless version - a Zfm if you will. You can’t run two different mounts expecting people to upgrade and require new lenses.

The fact that the Zfc is paired with a FF lens makes me believe that Nikon will release a FF version in the near future.
 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Location
SW Virginia
Real Name
Steve
The Df was the previous SLR version, but they need a FF mirrorless version - a Zfm if you will. You can’t run two different mounts expecting people to upgrade and require new lenses.

The fact that the Zfc is paired with a FF lens makes me believe that Nikon will release a FF version in the near future.
I gotcha.
 

gryphon1911

Hall of Famer
Location
Central Ohio, USA
Real Name
Andrew
I mentioned that IBIS might be less of a concern if the high-ISO performance is good; DPR's Z50 review had some good performance in their test image. Obviously high-ISO performance doesn't help if I want to use a slow shutter handheld for artistic purposes - I'm used to having it in M4/3 in order to counteract the poor noise performance. I went to Camerasize to compare it with my Olympus EM5ii just for kicks, as expected there's a significant size difference, but look at the weight comparison! Z fc vs. EM5ii Shows just how dense and overbuilt the shell of the EM5ii is (a factor I quite like about that camera).

I had some serious shutter shock issues with numerous versions of the Oly EM5 Mark III, that I contribute to the lack of weight of the camera. Went back to an EM5 II because of it.
 

gryphon1911

Hall of Famer
Location
Central Ohio, USA
Real Name
Andrew
The Df was the previous SLR version, but they need a FF mirrorless version - a Zfm if you will. You can’t run two different mounts expecting people to upgrade and require new lenses.

The fact that the Zfc is paired with a FF lens makes me believe that Nikon will release a FF version in the near future.

They very well may, but features and price are something that needs to be highly considered for sell through. It would be hard for a lot of people to shell out $2000 for a retro styled body when they can get that in Fuji all day and all night. Nikon making this camera $950 body only makes a ton of sense on many different fronts. I think it will be way more successful than the Df ever was.
 
Location
S. Oregon Coast
Real Name
Andrew L
I had some serious shutter shock issues with numerous versions of the Oly EM5 Mark III, that I contribute to the lack of weight of the camera. Went back to an EM5 II because of it.
It's stupid and frustrating that M4/3 cameras haven't fully figured out and eliminated shutter shock - or, I should say, Olympus hasn't. Panasonic seems to have been good from the GX85 forwards with their newer shutter designs.
 

CraigC

Top Veteran
Location
Toronto, Canada
Real Name
Craig
They very well may, but features and price are something that needs to be highly considered for sell through. It would be hard for a lot of people to shell out $2000 for a retro styled body when they can get that in Fuji all day and all night. Nikon making this camera $950 body only makes a ton of sense on many different fronts. I think it will be way more successful than the Df ever was.

No doubt price is the main driver, as this is likely a “test” for them. If the sell a bunch, more retro models/lenses will follow.

But, imo, if they were serious about the APSC market (and targeting Fuji), they would have released a couple of DX lenses with this body.

The issue for Nikon right now is that you can get the Z5 for only $50 more. A camera with a FF sensor, IBIS, and many more native lenses designed to make use of that sensor. If that’s not a loss leader, you have to think that they could easily make a Zfm for $1300 - $1400, which would be a really strong competitor in the market.
 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Location
SW Virginia
Real Name
Steve
No doubt price is the main driver, as this is likely a “test” for them. If the sell a bunch, more retro models/lenses will follow.

But, imo, if they were serious about the APSC market (and targeting Fuji), they would have released a couple of DX lenses with this body.

The issue for Nikon right now is that you can get the Z5 for only $50 more. A camera with a FF sensor, IBIS, and many more native lenses designed to make use of that sensor. If that’s not a loss leader, you have to think that they could easily make a Zfm for $1300 - $1400, which would be a really strong competitor in the market.
Wow. I did not realize the Z5 was that cheap. Only another $100 for the lens. That’s pretty aggressive on Nikon’s part.
Edit: that $1100 dollar kit with lens was a refurb. Sorry. At Adorama if you are interested.
 
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