Nikon Nikon Z fc Talk

It's stupid and frustrating that M4/3 cameras haven't fully figured out and eliminated shutter shock - or, I should say, Olympus hasn't. Panasonic seems to have been good from the GX85 forwards with their newer shutter designs.
What's wrong with the Olympus solution -- use the diamond drive mode (EFCS) with 0-second delay? I shot the Pen-F 100% that way, literally no problems whatsoever.
 
I'd say they only have a real chance of winning in the retro field if they commit to primes. I get that casual users usually go with zooms, but there is a whole fleet of Fuji users for whom the prime lens stable is a main attraction, if nothing else they're all going to continue sending a contrary message to new buyers who might otherwise be swayed by Nikon's marketing.
If Nikon was attacking Fujifilm with the Zfc then this is a weird strike.

I have said elsewhere, earlier, that Df is kinda like Fuji XT-series on steroids. But the XT series also holds its own against the DSLR so the opposite could also apply. I went for Df after some experiments and mild dissatisfaction from XT3.

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The 28/2.8, styled after Ai lenses, looks cute and retro but I think it will definitely be a one-off type of release.

Will Nikkors render better in DX than Fujinons? I would say, I'm inclined to favor Nikkors but it's a matter of taste. The problem is that Fuji has a better selection of glass with aperture rings. One retro styled release without an aperture ring doesn't constitute an attack against Fuji in my opinion.

Mounting the vintage Nikkors on Zfc is probably not what Nikon put on first priority. The DX crop factor removes some of the fun out of the lenses, weight imbalance will be noticeable, and the tiny body has no suitable grip for it anyway.

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If Nikon wanted to tease Fuji fans a bit more, they should market the Picture Controls a bit more during the summer.


 
What's wrong with the Olympus solution -- use the diamond drive mode (EFCS) with 0-second delay? I shot the Pen-F 100% that way, literally no problems whatsoever.
And that works great for the PEN-F, but even in EFCS mode on the EM5 III, there were issues with mine. I sent them back, talked with Olympus…but after the third body doing the same thing with many, many lenses. I gave up on it.
I firmly believe that it has everything to do with the body being way too light and not having the ability to properly dampen the shutter mechanism.

I mean, I can feel the body vibrate hard when the shutter is released. I even tested it with full electronic shutter and that was the only time that it didn’t have an issue. Deal breaker for me as I shoot a lot of moving subjects and didn’t want to have to deal with the rolling shutter issue that mode brings.
 
No doubt price is the main driver, as this is likely a “test” for them. If the sell a bunch, more retro models/lenses will follow.

But, imo, if they were serious about the APSC market (and targeting Fuji), they would have released a couple of DX lenses with this body.

The issue for Nikon right now is that you can get the Z5 for only $50 more. A camera with a FF sensor, IBIS, and many more native lenses designed to make use of that sensor. If that’s not a loss leader, you have to think that they could easily make a Zfm for $1300 - $1400, which would be a really strong competitor in the market.

the camera market is different and most companies acknowledge that now. Nikon would not survive if they stuck to the same methodology they did with the DSLR. There were too many cameras. D3000,D5000,D7000,D500, all APS-C. It never made sense to me to have that much in the same sensor space.

now, with the shrinking market for dedicated cameras, everyone needs something that stands out. There is a resurgence for the analog aesthetic but people still want the convenience of modern. That is one of the reasons Fuji is so loved in the market, the physical look and few of their bodies. The other is the jpg engine and options for getting the look you want straight out of camera.
I feel Nikon is looking to take advantage of that same thing here in the looks department. It will appeal to a lot of people at a good price point.

no matter what they do, though, they will never please everyone with the lens lineup for APS-C. That will always be something to whine about. I saw on another site where people were complaining about the 28mm f/2.8. Their issue was that “Nikon could have made it even smaller if they designed it as a dedicated APS-C lens.” If that is not small enough, then they are complaining because they like to hear themselves talk.
 
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What's wrong with the Olympus solution -- use the diamond drive mode (EFCS) with 0-second delay? I shot the Pen-F 100% that way, literally no problems whatsoever.
I mean, you'd have to ask @gryphon1911 about that, I haven't had an Olympus with shutter shock issues since the EP1, and my EM5ii doesn't have an issue, but if the newest EM5 iteration has it again, that's not great on their part.

EDIT: hadn't read his response yet.
 
I mean, you'd have to ask @gryphon1911 about that, I haven't had an Olympus with shutter shock issues since the EP1, and my EM5ii doesn't have an issue, but if the newest EM5 iteration has it again, that's not great on their part.

EDIT: hadn't read his response yet.
The issue seems worse with Panasonic lenses. I was testing the EM5.3 with the Panasonic 35-100/2.8 and 12-60/2.8-4. Pretty bad shutter shock artifacting, so tested with the oly 75-300, 25mm f/1.8. Issues still there but not as bad - but bad enough to have it ruin some shots for me.

it may just be me, but I texted the same lenses with similar settings on the EP5 and EM1 and those bodies were rock solid with all the lenses mentioned above.

I hope it was just me and a string of bad luck for me, but 3 bodies I thought were enough of a test bed to decide to stay away.
 
Of all my Olympus bodies, the E-M5II was the most rock solid in terms of 5-axis IBIS and no shutter shock. My E-PM2 and E-P5 suffered from shutter shock all requiring shutter replacements at Precision Camera Repair under Olympus warranty. My E-M5 mk.I and E-M10 had no issues. My Pen-F also had no shutter shock, but the 5-axis IBIS wasn't as good as the E-M5II. Though the Olympus body I was most fond of was the E-PL2! Clunky, slow to AF, but had decent IBIS and those SOOC images were beautiful!
 
Full disclosure, I have been and some might still call me a Nikon fan boy (at least when compared to Canon and Sony).

The fc looks like it could be a very good camera; functions, features, and style seem great (one main thing I think should have been different).

But I think it's the wrong camera for Nikon. In no particular order.
  • Colors? That should have been kept to just the rumored Z30 if they wanted to create a fashion accessory.
  • Looking at the DPReview video the fc is visibly smaller than the FE, width and thickness. So yes an FX would have been bigger than the fc, but probably not that much bigger than the FE.
  • My one thing above? Why PASM? An A on the shutter speed and program an A setting below the max aperture controlled by the body dial and display the A on the little LCD.
  • An FX version with the 28mm and 40mm would be great kit. Timing and marketing would have been perfect. Instead we'll have a 42mm and 60mm eq set? You know the focal lengths everyone has been asking for?


  • But the big one. This would be great with nice small APS-C glass like Nikon (and Canon) had for their APS-C systems. Oh that's right 15 years of APS-C cameras from Nikon and Canon and Canon had 1 pancake / 1 macro while Nikon had the 35mm, a 10.5mm fish, and 2 macros, were there other primes? I would love to be proven wrong, but I just don't see it happening and with the limited market it just doesn't make sense to me.
Yes there seem to be some notable upgrades over the Z50. But with this model does this mean Nikon will have a 4 camera APS-C lineup? That's at least 1 too many to @gryphon1911 point. Z30 / fc / Z50 / Z70 (?) since they will need something to replace the D500. Or at least I hope they learned their lesson when they tried to go from the D300 to the D7000. It took a while for them to wake up and come out with the D500.

Sorry if this seems a little
soapbox-888.gif


But so far I REALLY have liked pretty much everything about the Z series and what Nikon has released (I think the Z50 should have had IBIS but that's about it), I just can't afford to switch right now otherwise...
 
Or... you know, make nice small and cheap DX lenses...
Nikon isn't going to flesh out their Z APS-C lens line-up. They barely made any crop lesnes for their DSLRs. I'd rather keep with the retro styling and get close to FF coverage with a focal reducer with my manual focus Nikkor Ai/Ai-S lenses. Even better if I can get AF with my newer Nikon F-mount lenses. It'd be a cheap way to get FF with Nikon retro looks and image processing!
 
Been reading about the new Nikon. I have a D7100 and a pile of primes, a few are AF most modified Pre-AI lenses. With that glass I am really not the fellow that Nikon is aiming this at even though I don't mind the faux retro look. In the end for a Z to be useful to me, I'd have to get a Z-5 for FF with the FTZ adaptor to use my old lenses which really defeats one of the big advantages of the Z - getting rid of the mirror box.

I'd probably be better off with a D780 instead despite the far higher cost.

But I'd love a FF version of the Z fc with a nice 50/1.8 prime...
 
If I were starting and had to pick between Fuji and Nikon for APS-C, I'd pick Fuji. Aside from the the larger lens collection and IBIS, I know Fuji is far more committed to APS-C than Nikon. I think everything else if pretty much a wash or a matter of personal preference.
 
I had some serious shutter shock issues with numerous versions of the Oly EM5 Mark III, that I contribute to the lack of weight of the camera. Went back to an EM5 II because of it.
I actually find EM5.2 being very capable and good camera and I have specific need for it. I think I’ve mentioned this already, discrete photography in funerals or other festive occasions. People barely notice me taking photos and are always surprised of the results.
(I hope in a good way 🙄)

But this was side note to Nikon discussion
 
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The 28 is going to be a nice addition for me. And should/when I add the ZFc down the road there are some affordable and fast "Artisan" manual focus lenses with z mounts. Fast(very) 35s, a 21mm F1.5, a 60mm macro, a 55mm 1.4, a fisheye. While certainly not the best performers, probably not too bad and a lot of fun. I think the majority would actually look pretty good on it too.
And there is the Viltrox trio down the road. 23, 33 and 56. They performed nicely on Fuji. Might be really nice if there's a future IBIS body.
 
Don't hold your breath re. I.B.I.S. I have a feeling that this might well become one of the distinguishing features for the FX line - DX: compact, maybe even elegant/stylish/hipster (pick your moniker), affordable, truely portable; FX: enthusiast/professional level, with full sealing, I.B.I.S. etc.

I honestly find it sort of strange that people assume Nikon will simply continue their former strategy - isn't it time to change it? What I see on the DX timeline points towards (advanced) entry level - and in my opinion, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, especially if entry level means Z 50 level solid. The Z 50 is more than a match for the D5600 and approaches the D7500 in many ways while being clearly more compact and more affordable than the latter. Would it be nice if there was a D500 replacement? Definitely, and I think there will be, maybe even including I.B.I.S. to make it more of a hit, but I'd not be surprised if this was low priority at the moment. There are market shifts to consider, and I think Nikon does pretty well in terms of filling the remaining niches. The Z cameras offer a lot for the money and a more keenly priced than the competition.

The Z fc has enough to distinguish it from the Z 50 in my eyes - it may be the even better EDC, but less capable as a "second body" (which the Z 50 is for me - including its additional reach with FX lenses). It's also more desirable for vloggers (not that I am one, but who knows where the fancy might take us). I laid out my view on it in a different thread already.

I'll pre-order the Z fc with the 28mm - it hits the spot for me; my Sony stuff (and a whole host of various lenses all over the board) is scheduled for trade-in, and by the time the camera becomes available, the whole Fuji system may be, too. Not because it's bad (it obviously isn't), but because I'm happier with my Z system than I've been with either Sony (that's not difficult, given their handling paradigm) or Fuji - which I'm surprised about myself, but that's how things are. Maybe a X-S1 could have changed that - but I'm not going to try that now the path appears clear: The FX system is where it's at for me, the DX stuff being a nice and fun complement - I don't think I'll put a lot of money in it anyway, but so far, it has paid off hugely.

M.
 
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