Sony TheCameraStoreTV: RX100 III and Canon G7X...terrible Canonitis disease

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj

Ray Sachs

Legend
Sep 21, 2010
Not too far from Philly
you should be able to figure it out...
Ray, why do you think they had such a bad experience with the AF on the G7x? I'm very curious because 1. I remember when they compared the rx100iii it's AF was significantly slower than the GM1 and 2. The G7x was going to be my go everywhere pocket cam. Any insights are welcome, thanks!
Not a clue. I've seen different reviews that reach different conclusions on this very question. Which generally leads me to believe there must not be an obvious difference. I don't doubt that the AF on the RX100 III is very good - it was good on the RX100 I and I don't think it would have gotten worse.... I've also had no problems at all with the G7X AF. I've had one or two mis-focussed shots, but they may have just been a matter of narrower DOF than I was anticipating and focussing on the wrong detail as a result. It's quite quick. Maybe in a specific lighting situation you could recreate their results, but generally the Canon does really well, even in pretty low light.

I generally really like their videos but found this one incredibly one sided. They make a huge deal of the click vs non-click wheel. I agree that it's nicer for manual focus without a click, but for every other function that wheel serves (aperture, shutter speed, step zoom, ISO, I much prefer the click. And I don't use it for manual focus, so their weakness can also be seen as a strength. They never mention some features that I think are big plusses for the G7X while stressing really minor differences. I continue to believe that the real significant differences between these cameras are the EVF on the Sony side and the lens speed and range and the touch-screen on the Canon side. I personally find a couple of the handling and customizable features on the Canon to be a big deal, but I don't assume they would be for most people. It's true that the G7X is softer at the wide end - it's a tradeoff for a more aggressive lens. If you're into pixel peeping corners, it may be a real difference. If you're not, you'll never see the difference...

I think these guys are right in their overall critique of Canon as a company - they've been followers rather than leaders for quite a while. But I don't think you trash a particular camera based on that. Comparing the two cameras, I think they're WAAAAAY off base. Frankly, this will likely color my opinion of their videos for a while.

-Ray
 

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj
I think these guys are right in their overall critique of Canon as a company - they've been followers rather than leaders for quite a while. But I don't think you trash a particular camera based on that. Comparing the two cameras, I think they're WAAAAAY off base. Frankly, this will likely color my opinion of their videos for a while.

-Ray
Yes, I've found their reviews to be increasingly nitpicky although I do have to credit them for me going toward the GR instead of the Nikon coolpix, although the price factor also had a lot to do with it. Having said that, I just checked amazon and the Nikon is at the same price as the Ricoh and it's the USA not the gray market model.


On canon as a company, I did regret not getting the 5dmk3 but now I'm glad that I didn't as it seems that canon glass doesn't resolve very well at high resolution, according to dxo at least. I have always liked their point and shoot cameras though.
 

Peytonphoto

Regular
Oct 4, 2014
Yes, nitpicky, but the CameraStore seems very thorough with their reviews.



Yes, I've found their reviews to be increasingly nitpicky although I do have to credit them for me going toward the GR instead of the Nikon coolpix, although the price factor also had a lot to do with it. Having said that, I just checked amazon and the Nikon is at the same price as the Ricoh and it's the USA not the gray market model.


On canon as a company, I did regret not getting the 5dmk3 but now I'm glad that I didn't as it seems that canon glass doesn't resolve very well at high resolution, according to dxo at least. I have always liked their point and shoot cameras though.
 

Ray Sachs

Legend
Sep 21, 2010
Not too far from Philly
you should be able to figure it out...
Ray, why do you think they had such a bad experience with the AF on the G7x? I'm very curious because 1. I remember when they compared the rx100iii it's AF was significantly slower than the GM1 and 2. The G7x was going to be my go everywhere pocket cam. Any insights are welcome, thanks!
Check out the Cameralabs review, now finalized - they find exactly the opposite, with faster AF on the G7X:

http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Canon_PowerShot_G7X/index.shtml

"I tested the Canon G7X alongside the Sony RX100 III and found for Single AF acquisitions, the G7X proved quicker and more confident under pretty much all conditions. Don't get me wrong, the Sony's no slouch, but at times could hunt for half a second to one second, whereas for the same subject under the same conditions the Canon generally locked-on almost the instant I pressed the shutter release halfway. Both can employ continuous AF behind the scenes to get the focus close before you half-press or take the shot, but again I felt the Canon had the edge whether shooting wide, long, close or far.

In terms of continuous AF I tried the G7X with subjects striding or running towards me at full telephoto and the maximum aperture using the Continuous shooting with AF mode (thanks for being game Chris Chabot!). When the subject was distant, say, 30m, the camera didn't seem sure what to focus on, but as the subject came closer you could see and hear it working, and the result was a fairly high percentage of keepers. I still wouldn't describe it as anywhere near the performance of a camera with a phase detect AF system, but for a contrast-based compact it was definitely above average - and noticeably more successful than the Sony RX100 III."


Again, I can't explain the difference in conclusions and I don't think the difference really matters much either way, but the reviewers aren't in the same place on this. All I can say is that the G7X is really really good - AF I never would have expected from a compact just a couple of years ago. I felt the same way about the RX100 when it first appeared though, and don't find a lot of difference between them...

-Ray
 

Ray Sachs

Legend
Sep 21, 2010
Not too far from Philly
you should be able to figure it out...
And just that quickly, DPR has added a section complaining about the G7X AF. Maybe not all units are the same??? Or maybe all reviewers are not the same - hell, I don't know...

-Ray
 

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj
And just that quickly, DPR has added a section complaining about the G7X AF. Maybe not all units are the same??? Or maybe all reviewers are not the same - hell, I don't know...

-Ray
Could be early production issues. I know that in the video they were focusing on a field. Saw the camera labs review and it seemed fine to me. Who knows.

How many times can you return defective cameras to amazon before they flag your account?
 

Ray Sachs

Legend
Sep 21, 2010
Not too far from Philly
you should be able to figure it out...
Could be early production issues. I know that in the video they were focusing on a field. Saw the camera labs review and it seemed fine to me. Who knows.

How many times can you return defective cameras to amazon before they flag your account?
I don't know but I've returned a number of non-defective products to both Amazon and B&H and have never had any issues. I'd think for truly defective products, they wouldn't give you any trouble at all...

In terms of early production issues, could be - it wouldn't be uncommon. I just read a long diatribe about the horrible exposure comp dial that you can't turn with one hand, while mine is just fine - stiff enough not to turn accidentally but easy to turn with one thumb. Although it does turn the wrong way, at least the way I'm not used to from any other camera...

-Ray
 

Luckypenguin

Hall of Famer
Dec 24, 2010
Brisbane, Australia
Nic
Unfortunately I have to say with TCS and their videos is that since I first started watching them (and enjoying their early work very much) they have begun to suffer from celebrititis, a condition found amongst camera reviewers where their reviews become less balanced and informative and more inward looking. Sorry TCS boys, had to say it!
 

bartjeej

Hall of Famer
Nov 12, 2010
bart
About the exposure comp dial being reversed, this way actually makes more intuitive sense to me than the "normal" way, which keeps confusing me on the X100. On the Canon, you pull down, and push up, when you look at the left hand side of the dial (which is where it meets the "dot" on the body). Pulling up and pushing down just doesn't make any sense to me.
 

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj
Unfortunately I have to say with TCS and their videos is that since I first started watching them (and enjoying their early work very much) they have begun to suffer from celebrititis, a condition found amongst camera reviewers where their reviews become less balanced and informative and more inward looking. Sorry TCS boys, had to say it!
I had the same thought but didn't want to say it. Who knew YouTube celebrities would exist in the camera review world lol
 

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj
About the exposure comp dial being reversed, this way actually makes more intuitive sense to me than the "normal" way, which keeps confusing me on the X100. On the Canon, you pull down, and push up, when you look at the left hand side of the dial (which is where it meets the "dot" on the body). Pulling up and pushing down just doesn't make any sense to me.
I'm finding the x100s odd control wise (at least for me) since I have my dslr set up to expose to the right, literally. Shutter speed, aperture and exp comp all set to turn right to under expose. The opposite of fuji
 

wojconner

Regular
Aug 20, 2014
Woj
*cough* Kai from DigitalRev *cough*
True on Kai buuuuuuut at least he is comical and more than occasionally helpful. TCS is helpful but rarely comical IMO. Their G7x review was neither helpful or comical.

Alas, I missed my opportunity to become the youtube camera thrashing sensation lol
 

serhan

All-Pro
May 7, 2011
NYC
I like the g7x, eg controls, colors, etc, but I don't think it is a P&S that you can carry with you and use for everything. Yes, I had af issues with my limited use, usually backfocusing with smaller objects, even a bird fills most of the center or a leave on the ground. Dof and bokeh is nice with its fast and longer lens, but again the shots are limited by its softness/af issues in close distances and the lens corrections esp on the wide side. I usually use med jpgs... I might try a LX100 instead of these 2, but again it is a bigger camera with a similar lens correction to Canon G1X M1 eg a little less compromised lens... Again that is crippled by its design with no touch af and tilt lcd... Maybe 2nd, 3rd gen of these camera will improve the shortcomings, but one sided positive reviews that I see with g7x doesn't help to the consumers, but helps to the sites with online buy this camera links...
 

val

Veteran
Dec 27, 2013
I like TCS but sometimes there is too much banter and they seem to annoy each other more than I reckon they need.
 

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